16 Responses to “Can the Catholic Church ever have a national consciousness?”

1. Charles Says:
   August 16th, 2013 at 2:48 pm

   Thank you Mario for this explanation which makes many things absolutely clear.

2. Cerberus Says:
   August 17th, 2013 at 8:42 am

   Here is what I found in Google about why celibacy was introduced to the Catholic church. Earlier Catholic church priests were allowed to marry. I think it is a bad idea not allow marriage since it has led to sexual abuse of children by priests who had no other outlet. The Catholic Church has become a sort of Corporation which is more interested in profits and power more than the true spiritual welfare of the people and the country as a whole.

   Even the Buddhist priests (as opposed to monks) must examine this part of the Vinnaya requirements. In the absence of the living Buddha stringent rules may not be followed properly by large numbers who enter priesthood. I think it is in Burma that people can become Buddhist priests for a short time. This method may suit Sri Lanka too.

   “Why did celibacy become mandatory for priests?
   Let me start by copying and pasting an answer to a similar
   question received previously. You will find the rest of my answer to your
   specific question after the following:
   Can you tell me when the Catholic church started insisting its priests
   were celibate?
   How celibacy became common and why it became required are two very
   different things. In the third and fourth centuries it became common in
   primitive Christianity for men to choose asceticism as a way of expressing
   their devotion to God. Asceticism is a general term to describe the
   philosophy that one becomes close to God through radically denying oneself
   the pleasures of life. Asceticism throughout history has included
   celibacy, ritualistic fasting, cloistering (removal from all outside human
   contact in monasteries), willful injury of oneself (walking on knees many
   miles, cutting oneself in places where Jesus was wounded, etc.), becoming
   a hermit, purposefully wearing only rags,… The list could go on.
   Celibacy has certainly not been limited to Christianity. The Essenes were
   an ascetic Jewish sect active at the time of Jesus Christ. Hinduism,
   Buddhism and especially Jaina are world religions which have inspired many
   to turn to asceticism.
   Getting back to Christianity, there was a strong movement in
   Christianity toward asceticism by the third century AD. This was
   especially dominant in the North African churches. Many, in their
   misguided, but perhaps sincere desire to become godly chose to become
   hermits, to practice celibacy and so forth. By the fourth and fifth
   centuries, orders of monks became common, including vows of celibacy and
   poverty.
   During this time, one might be surprised that celibacy amongst
   priests was not overwhelmingly common. In fact, in the eighth ninth and
   tenth centuries AD, polygamy and concubinage was very common amongst Roman
   Catholic priests. Eventually, Rome even sanctioned catholic priests
   taking a second wife if their first became sick. However, this clear
   violation of biblical teaching led to a problem. With so many children of
   priests running around, inheritance became a huge problem. In an effort
   to protect church property, Pelagius I required all priests to sign an
   agreement not to allow any of their children to inherit church property.
   In AD 1022 Pope Benedict VIII officially declared that priests were banned
   from taking on wives or mistresses in order to protect church property
   rights, although those who were married before entering the priesthood
   were allowed to keep their wives. Finally, in AD 1139, Pope Innocent II
   declared all priest marriages annulled, declaring celibacy the rule for
   all Catholic priests from that day forward. To be fair to Innocent II,
   his reforms were at least as much directed toward eliminating the blatant
   sin in the priesthood as toward protecting church property. There were a
   number of attempts from within the catholic priesthood to reinstate
   marriage as a possibility right up until the sixteenth century.
   To summarize, asceticism in general and asceticism in particular
   were begun as a very misguided but probably mostly sincere attempt by some
   early Christians to express their spirituality. When celibacy was finally
   enforced for the priesthood it was principally as a rather cynical means
   of protecting church property from inheritance by the children of priests.
   As a final note, consider two passages from the New Testament
   which have bearing on the foolishness of asceticism as a means of
   spirituality. Colossians 2:20-23 teaches that asceticism–the enforced
   denial of normal (but not sinful) human pleasure has absolutely no value
   in protecting us from real temptation. Also 1 Timothy 4:1-5 teaches that
   those who seek to enforce asceticism (specifically celibacy, fasting from
   certain foods and so forth) are from “deceitful spirits and doctrines of
   demons.” Let us not fall into this temptation.
   John Oakes, PhD
   Let me add to this slightly in response to your question.
   First of all, the whole idea of a separate priesthood in Christianity
   whose function is to somehow act as a representative and go-between for
   “normal” Christians to come to God is completely foreign to the
   Christianity of the Bible. 1 Peter 2:4-10 describes all Christians as a
   royal priesthood. The idea of a disciple of Jesus coming to God through
   the mediation of a human being is anathema to biblical teaching, as seen
   from 1 Timothy 2:5, “For there is one God and one mediator between God and
   men, the man Jesus Christ, who gave himself as a ransom for all men….”
   and other passages.
   The idea of celibacy of the priesthood implies the existence of a
   separate priesthood within the ranks of Christians. This concept is not
   found in the New Testament. It is diametrically opposed to New Testament
   teaching. For this reason, it may be an interesting historical question
   where the teaching of celibacy for the priesthood of the Roman Catholic
   church came from. However, for the purpose of pursuing a relationship
   with God through Jesus Christ, it is not a relevant question. A better
   question is whether it is a good thing for a priest of God (ie any
   Christian) to be celibate. But that is another question….
   John Oakes”

3. Mr. Bernard Wijeyasingha Says:
   August 17th, 2013 at 2:06 pm

   I agree with the article that the Catholic faith is heirachical in the same manner of the Vajrayana Buddhism praticed in Tibet: but what I do not agree is that the laity are no different that the Dalits of the cast system. To quote the article “There is a vital question that issues from this labyrinth of reasoning. Where do ordinary believers fit into this scheme of the divine? They really form the ‘bottom rung’ in that assimilation with God, which is akin more to a caste system than a feudal system”

   As a Catholic I was taught that all Catholics are my brothers and sisters with equal standing under the eyes of God. I was taught that my soul is immortal but born with the “original sin” perpetrated by Adam and Eve in the garden of Eden. I was taught that the only way to cleanse one of this oiriginal sin was to be baptized where the ritual and the holy water removes that stigma. I was taught that Jesus Christ the son of God the father came to earth in human form to sacrifice himself for the sins commited by the world. Jesus Christ became The compassionate Lord Jesus Christ upon his death on the cross and more importantly upon his resurrection to heaven body and soul. I was taught that we are responsible for our actions ever since Adam and Eve were driven out of the garden of Eden.

   We have the liberty to commit sin or not and the consequences of these actions. In the Catholic faith forgiveness takes a central role and anyone who has commited sin, truly repents and does not plan to do this again is forgiven by our Lord Jesus Christ. The journey Christ made from the last supper to the garden of Gethsemane to the trial by Roman Governor Pontius Pilate where he washed his hands of the case and instead gave the Jews to determine who should be crucified between Jesus Christ who claimed to be the son of God which was a blasphemy to the Jewish faith and a thief. They forgave the thief of the lesser crime and condemned Jesus Christ to be crucified as was his intention. Then the path Jesus took carrying the cross to Mount Calvary, to the crucifixion became the basis by which all Catholics see their lives for Catholics believe we symbolically bear that cross, we face betrayal and forgiveness and compassion. these are the basic foundations upon which Catholicism is built.

4. Mr. Bernard Wijeyasingha Says:
   August 17th, 2013 at 2:11 pm

   One final comment: When the Jews “condemned” Jesus Christ to his death the stigma of that action has been twisted to demonize the Jews. That act which should be interpretated as the will of God has been used to malign the Jews from henceforth leading the western world to marginalize, demonize and punish the Jews, culminating in the holocaust under Nazi Germany.

5. Ratanapala Says:
   August 17th, 2013 at 4:39 pm

   All this splitting of hairs or arguments how many angels can sit on a pin head are not required.

   History gives its verdict that throughout its blood spattered history it was a tyrannical organisation when all powerful and an organisation that supported tyranny and oppression when not. Its historical agenda is acquiring of power, more power, wealth and more wealth. For this purpose it is involved in evangelisation or conversion of adherents of other religions to Christianity. Those who are traditional Christians / Catholics and those who are evangelised and converted rarely identifies with those of other religions or creeds.

   For the time the Tamil Tiger Terrorists terrorised Sri Lanka – a period of nearly 30 years there was not a single Christian / Catholic organisation that condemned their terrorist activities nor worked whole heartedly for the eradication of terrorism in Sri Lanka and/or overseas. The Catholic Church at that time headed by Archbishop Oswald Gomis together with the Arch- Crook Lalith Kothalawala campaigned vehemently to bring the Christian Ranil Wickramasinghe to the Presidency of Sri Lanka.

   In Sri Lanka’s context they favour dismemberment of Sri Lanka to achieve their objective of converting Sri Lanka to be a majority Christian nation. This is the same goal that the islamists have too. This is the reason that the Catholic Church or any other Christian Church can never have a ” National Consciousness”.

   Catholic Church’s immediate goal is to support the provincial councils and to get the full powers to them including police and land powers. This way they get into a position they can influence corrupt politicians and carry out their evangelisation unhampered by central government interference.

   As for the celibacy of the priests they are left in a much better position than if they are non celibate by being able to practice all manners of deviant behaviour. The label celibate give them the opportunity to engage in heterosexual / homosexual and bisexual relations and sex with minors.

6. mario_perera Says:
   August 17th, 2013 at 8:16 pm

   Dear Bernard,

   Thank you for expressing your mind on my article. It is true that my article indicates a profound cleavage between people who are called ‘the faithful’ or ‘ordinary Catholics’, and the clergy in whatever be their structural differences. The faithful are the believers of tenets of faith instilled into them by the clergy. This you too affirm and confirm when you use the phrase ‘I was taught that…’. From this teaching flow a great number of moral obligations which you have enumerated as well.

   I do not dispute the matters of faith and morals that you dwell upon.

   My article is on the topic of ‘national consciousness’. My article asks the question: who is the VOICE of the Catholic Church? Who takes the decisions? And who bears the brunt of what the hierarchy says and decides on national issues?

   I wonder whether you will agree with me when I say that the ‘clergy’ or ‘hierarchy’ has regularly led the simple believers down the garden path on the matter of ‘national consciousness’. It is the simple believers that faced the ‘fall outs’ of their decisions. I have referred to some relevant matters in my article. Would it therefore be incorrect to say that the Catholic Church ( I am always on the question of ‘national consciousness) is divided into ‘Those who are the VOICE’ and ‘Those who are the VOICELESS’?

   You perhaps will agree with me when I say that the matter of 13A falls within the ambit of national consciousness? Would you and I get a chance of being the VOICE of the Catholic Church on such issues? We know what the cardinal and his priests said before the LLRC? Who become the punching bags of their decisions but the ‘faithful’ or ‘ordinary Catholics’? Who are at the receiving end of the national wrath? Has this not been the pattern of things since the very beginning? Is this not the continuing pattern even now? You would remember the school take over issue. You would also perhaps remember that some Catholics were shot and killed by the armed forces when they obeyed the ‘order’ of the hierarchy to resist eviction from the premises they were occupying, also on orders received. Who mourns for them now? Have they for once been remembered for their sacrifice by the hierarchy? That is the condition of the VOICELESS.

   You raise the issue of the Dalits. Are they not the VOICELESS ones of the Indian social system? Are they not the scape goats and the punching bags of that system?

   Do you agree with all that S.J.Emmanuel said and did and continues to say and do with total immunity and impunity from the Catholic hierarchy? When S.J.Emmanuel the ‘priest’ made his heretical declaration about suicide bombers being Catholic martyrs the Catholic hierarchy remained deaf and dumb. Bernard, It was I and I alone who took him on through a series of rejoinders published at the time in the Island and the Daily News.

   If you find the time, please answer the issues that I have raised.

   Thank you, Bernard.

   Mario Perera
   Kadawata

7. Fran Diaz Says:
   August 18th, 2013 at 8:12 am

   Mario, we thank you for your courageous stand on matters of importance.

   We also join you in voicing our thoughts and feelings, expanding the matter to all religions and National issues. The intent here is to find solutions to problems, not to undermine dignity of various religious institutions.

   First and foremost, we would like to address the problem of LOCATION of the Headquarters of the worlds great religions. if located outside a country, a religion will likely prove to be detrimental to the National issues of that country if a multi-ethnic and multi-RELIGIOUS society exists there. Those living in the Headquarters will never completely understand the country under scrutiny regarding a National problem, particularly in a multi-religious society.

   Take a look at the LOCATION of HQs of various religious institutions :

   The Buddhist Headquarters of Buddagaya are located in India.
   The Catholic Headquarters are located in the state of the Vatican, adjacent to Italy.
   The Anglican Church Headquarters are in Britain.
   The Islamic Headquarters are in Mecca, Saudi Arabia.
   etc.

   We humbly ask : Can these Headquarters of various religions solve our local National problems ? Will they truly understand our need for Security & Wellbeing ?

   Another Question: Why has Sri Lanka been chosen to solve the Tamil Caste Problems of Tamil Nadu ?

8. mario_perera Says:
   August 18th, 2013 at 9:43 am

   Dear Fran,

   Firstly, thank you for your gentle presence on this forum.

   Fran, I do not believe that Theravada Buddhism has any headquarters in India. Buddagaya is a place of pilgrimage, certainly of the utmost importance because of historical connotations, but nevertheless only a place of pilgrimage. Theravada Buddhism has its base in Sri Lanka which is also the center of its expansion in South East Asia. Sri Lanka is now (since Buddhism died out from India) the motherland of Theravada Buddhism.

   In my humble opinion you have correctly stated the headquarters of the other religions.

   To my mind, the location of headquarters of particular religions does influence their adherents on the issue of the integrity of this country. To my mind the acceptance of the primordial rights of Sinhalese Buddhism over all others is a sine qua non for accepting the unitary nature of the Sri Lankan State. Any contestation of this inalienable primordial right and all endeavours to supplant that birthright can only impinge on that Unitary State ideal.

   The Tamil issue would never have been a problem had India not been our closest and only neighbour.

   Fran, thank you for requesting my point of view.

   With kindest regards

   Mario.

9. Fran Diaz Says:
   August 18th, 2013 at 12:33 pm

   Dear Mario,

   Thank you for your kind comments.

   I think that the bulk of the Sri Lankan Sinhala/Buddhists have high regard and respect for India as the place of origin for all Buddhist sects, Theravada included, as it is Gauthama Buddha’s birthplace, the main place of his Teachings as well as where he passed away. The fact that Sri Lanka has retained its Theravada Buddhist identity is something of a miracle, given the past actions against the Buddhist Temples, monasteries, etc. throughout our history, and continues to this day.

   In Sri Lanka, the Sinhela/Buddhist rights will never be felt as an overall force given the strength of minority religious groups which have wider and stronger international connections via their religions and their Headquarters. This is because of various reasons, one being the size of the island and the number of Theravada Buddhists being small in Sri Lanka compared to the numbers in the other religious groups in huge countries outside.
   Numbers outside matter as it connects to commerce, education, finance, jobs, etc. in fact, to daily needs of life.

   Another is articulate communication in a world language, English in this case, and minorities of Sri Lanka being far more comfortable with use of English to communicate, and thus to acquire knowledge and mobility in the job market, political bargaining, etc.

   I think job opportunities and financial help through religious bodies play a large part for the economic wellbeing of minority religious groups.

   Theravada Buddhist countries ought to learn to help each other much more in these spheres. Practical help in daily living is a must between Theravada Buddhist countries.

   If the Buddhists of Lanka do not feel secure and their needs met with a feeling of wellbeing and peace, then Buddhists of Lanka have lost their sense of Nationhood. An insecure majority is not a good thing for ANY country, east or west. In the absence of a “National consciousness” by minority religious groups, plus an insecure majority religious group, how can a small country prosper,psychologically as well as materially ?

   How can we change this situation to a win-win one ?

   with good wishes,
   Fran

10. Fran Diaz Says:
    August 18th, 2013 at 1:53 pm

    P.S.: The Tamil issue is one emanating from Tamil Nadu, not so much from India. in earlier times, both India and Sri Lanka had common ground to escape Colonisation. What happened after Independence of both countries was that Tamil Nadu continued with her Separatist aspirations which failed because India put out Laws prohibiting secession. Today, Sri Lanka has some Laws prohibiting secession, but has not used these tools to good advantage because of Tamil Nadu, not so much India.

    Sri Lanka has to recognise that it is Tamil Nadu aspirations that have to be fended aside, and remove the 13-A forthwith through a Referendum. Fro a start, we could ban the TNA and by Law not allow racist political parties or entities to exist in Sri Lanka.

11. Lorenzo Says:
    August 18th, 2013 at 2:04 pm

    Agree.

    SL Tamilians are USED by Tamil Madu Tamilians to get TN aspirations.

    That is why it is IMPOSSIBLE to win SL Tamilians to support SL.

    The ONLY long term way is to KILL the bridge between TN and SL – Tamil Madu language.

    Banning TNA is good but does NOT stop Tamil Madu influencing.

12. Fran Diaz Says:
    August 18th, 2013 at 4:42 pm

    Lorenzo,

    We cannot ‘kill’ the Tamil Nadu language bridge. Reasonable use of Tamil is already allowed for N&E (Act from SWRD times),

    ————-

    Either we accept responsibility for the Tamil Caste problems of Tamil Nadu as our own problem, as in administrative parlance,
    take ownership & leadership for it, even though we in Lanka had NOTHING TO DO WITH IT, or we don’t take ownership or leadership for their problems. Which is it ?
    The Parliament has to decide and let the citizens of Lanka know, and the whole of the west and India too.

13. Lorenzo Says:
    August 18th, 2013 at 6:51 pm

    Fran,

    Then we have to STOP complaining about TN EXPORTING its HATE, GRIEVANCES and ASPIRATIONS to SL!! It will continue.

    Tamil Nadu language is the MEDIUM of tranferring all those.

    Because of this connection Tamils in SL feel they BELONG CLOSELY to TN people THAN to SL people.

    REASONABLE USE can be using it at home and NOTHING MORE than that. But now there is MORE THAN reasonble use. We have UNREASONABLE USE of Tamil in SL.

    Anyway Tamils have REJECTED the reasonable use concept calling it SINHALA ONLY.

    In Canada ALL Tamils speak English. New generation Tamils even don’t know Tamil as much as they know English or French!! Thanks to this, next gen Canadian Tamils will not IMPORT TN problems.

    In Malaysia ALL Tamils speak Malay. New generation Tamils even don’t know Tamil as much as they know English or Malay!! Thanks to this, next gen Malaysian Tamils will not IMPORT TN problems.

    If we choose to be the KINDEST ONE to them, the puppies will come after us. Don’t blame them afterwards. It is OUR FAULT.

    SL is the ONLY country to have the TN language as an official language. WHERE ELSE can the Tamils seek their ELAM than in SL? Can they look for an Elam where TN language is not even the official language? No.

    We have only ourselves to blame. “Hitha honda gani emadama budding”.

14. Fran Diaz Says:
    August 19th, 2013 at 5:54 am

    Lorenzo,

    I totally agree with you. I was trying to tell the Readers that we seem to be creating conditions in Sri Lanka that welcome Tamil Nadu Tamils who want to flee TN. Sri Lanka authorities (entire Parliament) must either accept this reality or stop it.

    After 1983 Riots, Tamils went to the west and brought the west into the fight to create Eelam. For low caste Tamils that was the way to win the admiration of the ‘high caste’ Tamils.

    LANGUAGE is the connection to Tamil Nadu, & the Hindu religion too.

    Some suggestions to stop bifurcation of Lanka :

    (1) Language as a ‘weapon’ has to stop. Less use of Tamil language in Sri Lanka the better. Use English as the link language.

    (2) Less dependency on Tamil Labor the better for survival of all in Lanka.

    (3) Do not allow the lower scale of the Hindu religion to manifest in Lanka. Tamil Nadu has banned animal sacrifice and Sri Lanka must stop all animal sacrifice by Law too.

    (4) DEPORT all illegal migrants in Sri Lanka.

15. Lorenzo Says:
    August 19th, 2013 at 6:21 am

    Fully agree.

    Except a very few, ALL SL kings from SL wrote their stone writings in ONE language. Why this nonsense now?

    I learned Sinhala at school. ANY Tamil can. Sinhala is easier than Tamil.

    IF all Tamils are Sinhala conversant, there is NO problem. NO ONE will be discriminated based on NAME! Then TN cannot POISON the minds of Tamils as they do now. Tamil National Alliance becomes a JOKE. Tamil homelands become a JOKE. It will set apart SLs from TN people.

    IF Sinhalese learn Tamil the opposite will happen.

16. Fran Diaz Says:
    August 19th, 2013 at 6:38 am

    If Sinhela people learn the Tamil language, then Sri Lanka will be an appendage of Tamil Nadu (and India). Do ANY Sri Lankans want that ?

    If Sri Lanka ever becomes an appendage of Tamil Nadu, TN will reimpose the Tamil Caste Structure in Sri Lanka too – that is the way they control society there. What do the Tamils of Sri Lanka and the Diaspora Tamils have to say to that ?

    NO, the only solution is for all to learn Sinhala language with English as the link language. ALL must take an Oath of Allegiance to Sri Lanka.

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